#84: Saving BIG with 3 Letters - HTS

Episode: 84 

Title: Norman Farrar Introduces Afolabi Oyerukon, Co-Owner of Honu Worldwide and a CEO of Trillion Source 

Subtitle: Optimizing HTS Codes 

Final Show Link: https://lunchwithnorm.com/episodes/episode-84-saving-big-with-3-letters-hts-w-afolabi-oyerokun/

In this episode of Lunch With Norm…, Norman Farrar introduces Afolabi Oyerukon, Co-Owner of Honu Worldwide and a CEO of Trillion Source.

Afolabi has always been passionate about finding things, haggling and negotiating prices. In this episode, he talks about what you need to know with HTS Codes and how to save just by being aware of it. 

If you are a new listener to Lunch With Norm… we would love to hear from you. Please visit our Facebook Page and join in on episode discussion or simply let us know what you think of the episode!

In this episode, we discuss:

• 07:02 : Afolabi’s Background
• 09:15 : What is an HTS Code?
• 14:42 : Where to Seek Help with HTS Codes?
• 28:33 : Real Life Example with HTS Codes
• 40:05 : Buying Stores because of HTS Reclassification
• 51:05 : Getting Started with HTS Codes
• 53:51 : Carlos Alvarez

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In this episode, we mentioned the following resources:

• https://theecomcooperative.com/
• https://lovethepodcast.com/lunchwithnorm
• https://hts.usitc.gov/
• Tariff Terminator Service
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Norman  0:02  

Hey everyone it’s Norman Farrar, aka The Beard Guy here. Happy New Year, Happy 2021 and welcome to another Lunch with Norm, The Rise of the Micro Brands.

Norman  0:24  

Okay, so we thought we’d start the year off right and just share with you guys a really cool secret, not really a secret but but a lot of sellers don’t know about it, brokers do. It’s called HTS, HTS codes, Harmonized Tariff Systems and Afolabi Oyerokun from Honu Worldwide is my partner, and he’s going to be coming on and breaking down those nasty three big lead not nasty, actually, they could save you 1000s and 1000s of dollars. So anyways, Afolabi is going to be coming on we’re going to be talking about that. Also, there’s something really cool I want to talk about just very quickly, also mentioned at the end, check out the eCom Cooperative. Okay, this is a group I was approached by probably two weeks ago and I got Afolabi involved and Shane got involved over a prREACH, Paul got involved over to the chat agency. Anyways, it’s a really great concept. It’s a group of sellers, eCom sellers or service providers that are pooling a bunch of giveaways. Now, I don’t know if they’ve hit their goal, but they wanted to give away $25,000 worth of free services. So all of these people have gone put together a free service and the grand prize is everything I don’t know if it’s going to be 5000, 10,000, 20,000. I know that we’ve given away at least I don’t know, it’s probably it’s going to be at least 1000 to $1500 worth of services, at least that so everybody else is going to be involved with this and you’ll notice a lot of the names, a lot of them have been on the podcast before, but check it out. It’s called the eCom cooperative. Kels, show the URL and anyways, check it out and Kelsey, are you there?

Kelsey 2:23  

Yes. Happy New Year, everyone. We got a bunch of people joining us already. Marcia, hello. 

Norman 2:32

Oh, David. He’s actually the founder of the eCmm Cooperative. So again, check it out. I got nothing. I don’t get affiliates. It’s just a really cool thing that we can do to help out eCom sellers. All right. So Marcia, yes. Happy 2021. David, Happy 2021. Marina.

Kelsey 2:56  

Oh Mark, Fatiha, Daniel, Radd, Milos. 

Norman  3:01  

We can tell the people that haven’t been up partying all night long. We had to rustle Afolabi out of bed. But that’s Afolabi.

Kelsey 3:12  

Speaking off, we actually had Melissa Simonsson on the podcast here. So we have a whole episode. But the eCom Collective?

Norman  3:21  

No. That is a Cooperative. That is also very, very cool. I stand behind that. I mean, it’s such a great organization for eCom sellers or Amazon sellers. So Radd, Fatiha, Milos. Oh my gosh, Andrew, Daniel. Man, everybody. There’s a lot of people. You know what? Kelsey, I said, when we got on this show today? I said, Yeah, I don’t know how many people are gonna show up. This is like the Christmas show. There’s tons of new people. So thank you for tuning in. All right, I’m gonna throw it over to you for a sec.

Kelsey 4:00  

So if you guys haven’t already, like this episode, you can share the video that always does well. But one thing I really wanted to ask The Beard Nation here, if you guys can write a review. It’s something we’re trying to push hard just for the first these two weeks, trying to get some social proof going. So if you guys can, if you’re in the Facebook group, I made a whole video that’s pinned to the top. But if not, you can go right to this link here and go straight to that podcast.

Norman  4:30  

Did you set that lovethepodcast.com?

Kelsey 4:33  

It’s a website though. But yeah, it takes two minutes, maybe three minutes if you don’t have the app already, like the Apple podcast, but Yep and join our group. We’re loving it.

Norman  4:46  

Yes. That’d be awesome. Yeah, Nathan and Manny, welcome. Okay.

Kelsey 4:52  

Oh, and one thing I want to do is just read a review. So if you guys write a review, we’re gonna read it here. So from Marina, Marina wrote a review yesterday and she gave us five stars. One of the best podcasts on eCommerce, we almost never missed an episode of Lunch with Norm, fantastic podcast, great guests, there’s so much valuable knowledge and experience to share. The best way to listen is live when you can ask questions and get your answers. Thank you, continue the great work. So thank you very much, Marina. If you guys write a review, we’re gonna read it on here.

Norman  5:25  

Okay and that reminds me if anybody would like to come on live and ask questions to Afolabi today, just ping Kelsey, and we’ll get you on the podcast. If anybody wants to just come on and say, Happy New Year. Let’s do that today as well. So anyways, if you want to come on, just say hi, or if you have a question for Afolabi. Let’s do that and have some fun with this podcast. All right. Okay. Now, it’s back to me. He just scooted off. Anyway, questions, just put them over to the right hand side. But right now let’s sit back, relax, grab a cup of coffee and enjoy the show. Are you in bed right now?

Afolabi 6:10  

Ah, you dragged me out of bed.

Norman  6:13  

You party animal.

Afolabi  6:18  

Happy New Year everyone.

Norman  6:19  

I guess I’m an old fart because I went to bed before midnight. Well, I guess in Israel or in Europe, or in Newfoundland, it might have been New Years, but I’m just an old guy now. How are you?

Afolabi  6:35  

Good, and you?

Norman  6:36  

Good. Really good. Thanks. So are you at the house? Are you at the warehouse?

Afolabi 6:43  

I’m at my house, just chilling, relaxing, taking it all in, thinking about the 2021

Norman  6:49  

Yeah, cuz you have some reports due today. No. Just joking. All right. If people don’t know you, why don’t you give a little bit of background about yourself and what you do.

Afolabi 7:02  

Happy New Year everybody. This is me again Afolabi. I’m just fascinated with finding savings, sourcing supply chains for 20, 25 years now. I just enjoy it. People ask me which one do I like best in Amazon business or supply chain. I still enjoy the supply chain. I enjoy a lot of sourcing, finding new products and finding savings. Pretty much, how can I save something, I just feel better, I feel good when I find savings. So that’s what I do. That’s what I live and breathe all day, looking for ways to just get savings and pass it on to people whether it’s in sourcing or warehousing or fulfillment wherever. Wherever we can add value to your business eCom. I love services, and I partnered with Norm to start Honu and 2020 was a great year and we’re looking forward to helping more people this year.

Norman  8:19  

Now, the other thing with Honu. I mean, it’s full service. So Afolabi will get involved with sourcing product innovation, 3PL services in China, 3PL services here. We were lucky enough this year to get involved well through some funding and to be able to open up a warehouse in Pennsylvania. But we are not talking about that we just wanted to, Well, I just wanted you to let everybody know who you are. What we’re here to talk about is three little letters that can save you 1000s of dollars and people don’t talk about it enough and they don’t know a lot of people don’t even know about it, especially if they’re new to Amazon or bringing products in from other countries. So let’s talk about this, HTS Codes What the heck is an HTS code?

Afolabi 9:15  

So HTS code is just a shortened form for the Harmonized Tariffs System. It is the system used to access duties to the products you’re bringing into the US. Now people confuse it with HS Codes. They’re very different. The HS Code is a global coding system for duty. But HTS is for the US.

Norman  9:47  

What does HS stand for?

Afolabi 9:49  

I think it’s just Harmonized. 

Norman 9:51

Make it up.

Afolabi 9:52

Yeah, Harmonized demo by the World Trade Organization or something. They just harmonized system or something for duties and nine out of 10 times, when you ask your supplier to give you the tariff rate or tariff code, they will give you an HS Code and there is nothing wrong with that. It is just that you cannot use an HS code to bring your goods into the US. You can use it to export it out of China but when it’s coming into the US, you need an HTS and that the difference between HS and HTS is 1000s and 1000s of dollars.

Norman  10:40  

Right? And then we get asked quite a bit about doing it themselves, like people going out and hey, how do I find HTS codes? Where can I look for it and why can’t I trust my Chinese manufacturer to do this for me? Why don’t we talk a bit about that? So how can people go out and find their own HTS codes?

Afolabi 11:07  

So there’s the website, I’m going to post the US government website on this. Now, let me see if I can put it on the chat. So the website is hts.usitc.gov. So that’s the website to go to, to find your HTS Code. When you’re bringing any product into the country into the US, you must have an accurate, valid HTS code so that the government can tell you so that you can know what duty rates you’re going to pay on your product. If you give the wrong one, you might end up paying a lot of money to the US government when you’re bringing your goods in, and it could affect your profit margin. Can you imagine when you’re doing a and this is one mistake that people make when they’re doing product research. They don’t think about HTS code, when you’re doing your product research, it’s a very important point. If you find a product on Helium 10, don’t just pull the trigger yet, go to this website and type in some keywords about your product, so that you can know the percentage of duties you’re going to pay. So add it to your product margin so you can know how profitable that product is. Because at the end of the day, when you bring in the product into the US, you have to pay this to the US government and it can really affect your profit if you don’t take it seriously.

Norman  13:00  

So Afolabi, we might be talking about 1% or 2%. It might be the Trump Tariff Tax at 25. But this could be 30 or 40% of extra. I mean, you could get nailed big time and I can give you an example. So I thought I was pretty good at this stuff and so I bring in natural soap 17% duty, okay. Anyways, when I revisited this, and I brought it in under castile soap, so you can’t fake or you can’t, what’s the word? You can’t lie about it. Okay. Anyways, this was castile soap, it was made out of olive oil and it came in at zero. So within a second of putting that, I save 17% tax. So it was that simple. It was just looking into it. So every shipment that I brought in since 2016, I’ve saved 17% and like we talked about knowing your numbers, if you don’t add that in and you’re doing your product research, I mean, you could be messed up right from the very beginning. We’re especially going to get into some of these samples. But we’ll do that in a second. So let’s talk a bit more about it. So who should be doing the research for your HTS, your manufacturer, a broker, the seller themselves. What’s the best way to go about doing this?

Afolabi 14:42  

If you have a really good broker, your broker should be well versed in HTS code. I mean the broker on the US side, I usually prefer the broker on the US side. Because on the China side, your manufacturer doesn’t know the US system. It doesn’t know how to interpret that. The HTS system in the US. So I would lean more to your freight forwarder on the US side to help you do the HTS code and one way to test them is just ask them, what is your duty rate? If they come back to you with an HS Code, know that they don’t know what they’re doing. Right? Run fast. If your freight forwarder is giving you an HS code, know that they don’t know what they’re doing. So run fast or go to that website I gave you, the hts.usitc.gov, I think Kelsey posted it on that one. Go there, type in your keywords for your product, it gets a little tricky because the HTS Code System that .gov website can go as much as five to six levels deep.

Norman  15:56  

Do you want to show and I know it’s gonna be hard if people are listening on audio, but we’ll post this in the show notes. Do you have that slide that you created to show everybody about the nine digits and break it down into subsections?

Afolabi 16:12  

I have it. Do you want me to share my screen?

Norman  16:14  

Yeah. Do you know how to do it on this platform?

Afolabi 16:16  

I think so. 

Norman 16:18

I messed you up. So this is where Kelsey starts singing a tune, show tunes. All right and while you’re doing that, because you do have a couple of slides that we can add into the notes. Does anybody want to pop on and does anybody have a question for Afolabi? Do you want to ask it live? Do you want to come on, say Happy New Year. Anything you want, today’s an open show and just a great turnout. So again, thank you everybody for listening today. Oh, you got a question here.

Kelsey 16:58  

From Radd. Do you do freight forwarding apart from 3PL?

Afolabi 17:05  

You mean knock on you?

Norman  17:07  

I think that’s what he’s talking about.

Afolabi 17:08  

Oh yes, we do the complete import from the beginning to the end. Not just the freight forwarding part but we do that but the whole complete from start to finish because I don’t know about you. I don’t like dealing with a lot of people alone, from your goods traveling from China all the way to where it’s going sometimes about six, seven hands can touch it, as you already know, Radd. So yes, we do the freight forwarding and the whole complete shipping directly to wherever you want to get it to.

Norman  17:45  

Okay, so yeah and who was it that’s from, was it Andrew? From Jakarta. Wow. That’s crazy. Yeah. I only learned about HTS code from another group Afolabi mentioned it on. Yes, I was on that call with you. So can you get into that Afolabi? Do you need a bit of time because I can go on to a couple of other questions.

Afolabi  18:17  

Do you see my sharings? 

Norman  18:19  

Yep, we see that.

Afolabi 18:20  

Okay, so this is it. So this is the configuration of HTS Code. So this is for coffee. Somebody’s bringing coffee. So chapter nine, which is see the HTS code is a 10 digit number. So look at how they broke the numbers down. The first two numbers is your chapter. So if you’re bringing coffee in the whole nine chapter is for coffee, tea and spices chapter nine of the US HTS code. Now, they start breaking it down into deeper levels so that you can zero in on your exact product category. So the next two digits are for coffee, whether or not roasted or decaffeinated coffee and skeans, coffee substitute containing coffee and then you go deeper and then it says okay, the point 21 is for roasted coffee not decaffeinated and then it goes deeper again, into point 00. That means it has no distinction and then the last digit, the last two digits is zeroing down and it says it’s for certified organic coffee. So when you go to this website, let me see if I can share the screen. Do you see the HTS search? 

Norman 19:51

No, no. 

Afolabi 19:53

Okay. Let me stop this one and then share another one.

Norman  19:58  

So you know when it gets really complicated, I can give you an example. So if you’re selling natural soap with essential oils, what’s the essential oil with coffee grounds in it as an exfoliator?

Afolabi 20:11  

Now you messed it up real good.

Norman  20:15  

That’s when you really do need somebody to decipher that.

Afolabi 20:18  

Yes. So that’s a good example. So another example is magnetic products or printed products. If you’re bringing in blank paper, nothing on it, just blank paper from China. It’s a completely different HTS code, and different tariff rates or different from if you’re bringing a printed paper. If you only print the letter D on that paper, it changes the code entirely. So it goes deeper. That’s why you have to use somebody that really knows this stuff. So that you can see the law, let’s say your coffee example. You’re bringing coffee with essential oil. Now, am I going to use the tariff code for essential oil or am I going to use the tariff code for coffee? Or what if there is no HTS Code that exists for essential oil infused coffee? What are you going to do?

Norman  21:32  

I’m gonna leave it to you.

Afolabi 21:34  

So that’s why it’s tricky to do. But it’s also good news because the US HTS system has not been able to catch up with the innovation that is happening among entrepreneurs now. Entrepreneurs are getting so innovative, that the HTS system can catch on to so there’s some gray area in that system, because they just can catch up with it. For example, maybe you may not even find any HTS Code for your essential oil infused coffee. So in that regard, I will probably go if the HTS code for coffee is 3% duty and essential oil is 45%. Of course, I’ll go for coffee 3%.

Norman  22:24  

It could get challenged, right?

Afolabi 22:26  

Yep, it could get challenged and that’s not a problem. If it does get challenged, you tell the customs and say look, I’m bringing in essential oil infused coffee. There’s no HTS Code for it. Yeah.

Norman  22:40  

You’re not trying to deceive anybody.

Afolabi 22:43  

Maybe they will tell you, Okay. Maybe you can use the edible essential oil category. Maybe that’s what they’ll tell you to use. That’s fine and if that exists already, the HTS Code for edible essential oil, then we can use it.

Norman  23:03  

So one of the things I want to go back to is, let’s say you’re working with a Chinese manufacturer who’s actually the manufacturer who speaks Chinese. This is one of the major reasons why I wouldn’t leave it up to the manufacturer to set this for me, because they’ve got to figure out, you saw how complicated that tariff code is. How are they going to figure it out? If they don’t speak English that well.

Afolabi 23:31  

When we launched our Tariff Terminator Service, I had a guy. He was a seven or eight figure seller on Amazon who reached out to me and said, Look, I like your HTS code stuff. I never heard of it before. I’ve been selling for five years, never HTS code. I’m like, how have you been bringing your products into the US? I just let the forwarder do it for me. I’m like okay, good. So all right, to help you can you send me all the HTS Code forwarder uses to bring your goods in? He sent me an Excel file and it was HS code all throughout. About 35 HS codes all in that and I said, this is HS code. It’s not HTS code. How much duty are you paying? He’s like, I don’t know. You don’t know how much duty you’re paying? He’s like, I don’t know. Anyway, we found out that he was paying about 25% duty when he was supposed to be paying 7.

Norman  24:37  

Oh my gosh.

Afolabi 24:39  

I said you’re losing a lot of money. This is money you’re putting in the toilet every time. So you’re right Norm, don’t trust your Chinese manufacturer to give you an HTS code because they don’t know. It is nothing against them. They just don’t know the US system. It is your responsibility to know the right HTS code for your product and apply it so you can save as much money as possible. 

Norman 25:12

So to be perfectly clear, two sellers can be selling the exact same thing, three sellers can be selling the exact same thing. Somebody can be paying zero, another person could be just paying the Trump Tax and then the other person could be paying both the HTS combined with the Trump Tax, we’ve got to talk about that and one could be 35%. One could be 25%. One could be nothing.

Afolabi 25:39  

Exactly. 

Norman  25:41  

So, if for anybody who’s new, or somebody who’s selling online, keep that into consideration, because you can save yourself a lot of money and you can give an example of a product that we had and oh, by the way, translation, yeah. So I always talk about Elena Saris with this one. She brought in pylons, but the freight forwarder didn’t know what to call them. So they called them flaming pyramids. First of all, they didn’t get into the country. Second of all, the HTS was just crazy. So anyways, she was able to straighten it out. But yeah, flaming pyramids for pylons.

Afolabi 26:33  

Another thing is, now if your goods arrive at the port, and you’re getting assessed with the high tariff code, or you’re suspecting that your tariff code is too high, your duty is too high, that’s not the end of the world, you can get an adjustment. Some people say, Oh my God, my goods are at port, it’s clear already. They’re assessing me to pay 25%, I guess I have to abandon the goods because I don’t have that kind of money to pay. Guess what? You can file an amendment for your tariff code. Don’t just throw your hands in the air and say, Oh my God, that’s the end of it. No, it’s not the end. In fact, you can read, do your customs filing with the right HTS code. If you find out that something was wrong, that was wrongly filed by your Chinese forwarder, you can still change it. Okay, so relax, don’t let it kind of deter you or make you sad. You can change and refile your customs filing and change the HTS code. It may just be a two day process but you can do it. 

Norman  27:51  

Well, I was just going to talk to you about, Ah, there it was, it must have been a lie. Oh man, it was just about the Chinese tariff codes in China again. Anyways, I’ll figure it out. It’s New Year’s Eve.

Afolabi 28:10  

Not New Year’s Eve.

Norman  28:13  

I went to bed before midnight, and I didn’t drink. Told you I’m getting old. Okay, so let’s move on to some examples. What’s an example that we’ve recently seen?

Afolabi 28:27  

Let me go to some examples here.

Norman  28:33  

These are real examples, by the way. So just to take a look, I know what it was. So one of the things that we see, and I don’t know why, but when you go and you talk to maybe it’s your manufacturer, maybe it’s freight forwarder, maybe it’s a broker. But it’s not the same company that you get the information from. I don’t know how many times we’ve seen this where people have called and said, My freight forwarder is refusing to use this HTS code.

Afolabi 29:04  

Yes, I do get it a lot and people come and say, Look, you guys find me an HTS code and my freight forward is refusing to use it. In that case, let me do the declaring for you because whatever this freight forwarder is doing they don’t know what they’re doing. Some freight forwarder they just don’t want to look stupid. They don’t want to look as if you did your homework. So they’ll say No, I’m not. I mean, I know big freight forwarders that do that. I can’t mention their names, but they always say this is what we must use for you. Look, they’re not the one paying. You are the one paying for that duty. So you have the rights to pay a fair amount. So if somebody refuses you HTS code and you know you’re right, you can go around them and file your thing by yourself. Right? Okay, or reach out to me or something. I deal with this all day. Somebody says, the HTS code, my forwarder or my shipper is refusing to use it. It’s because they’re trying to use in most cases, they’re trying to use an HS Code for you, or they’re trying to integrate your product in the wrong way and they don’t know much about your product, they’re  just guessing and if you’re translating from Chinese to English, then so many things will be lost in the translation. So many. 

Norman  30:46  

Yeah, so one of the things I want to mention too, and thank you Fatiha for mentioning that. But I want to make it clear, again, that this isn’t about like hiring Honu. This is about providing education for people sellers to make the best decisions. You can definitely reach out to Afolabi, but at the same time, you can reach out to other freight forwarders and just tell them your dilemma, and they would help you out as well. So again, this is strictly information. That’s why we bring on Afolabi and all of our guests. It’s not to say use that service. So there we go. Sorry, I just knocked away a couple of customers for you. But okay, so let’s bring up that slide.

Afolabi 31:37  

Okay, let us share the screen.

Norman  31:42  

Then we’ll get to some questions. I think there’s been a few.

Afolabi 31:46  

Okay, so let me share my screen here. Okay, you see my screen? Yep. Awesome. So let’s look at some real life scenarios. Alright. So, I mean, this product is very, very similar to these, it’s not this brand. So if you own this brand, I’m not trying to pick on you or anything. I’m just using it as one of the things we came across all the time. So the cost of goods is $50,000. Duty rate before reclassification is 4.9% plus Trump’s 25%. So I wanted to say this, when you’re looking at the tariff, when you go to that government website, and you type in your product stuff and you see your tariff rate, and then you see a slash next to it, a forward slash next to your tariff rate. That means there is a Trump rate added to it. So you have to click on that forward slash to be able to see that the rest of the 25%. Okay, so anytime you see a tariff rate that has a forward slash, know that there is more.

Norman  33:17  

That’s a great point.

Afolabi 33:18  

Know there is more. Let’s say it’s 4.9%. If the 4.9% has a forward slash next to it, please click on that forward slash, it will reveal the Trump’s additional tariffs. Okay. Alright. So this customer paid $50,000 from China to buy these goods, and the duty rate was 4.9% and there was a forward slash and when you click on the forward slash, it reveals the additional 25% many people think, Oh, that means I’m paying 29.5? No, that’s not what it means. Let me describe to you how the government assesses tariff code. So the first duty calculation, you’re going to use the first number 4.9% to calculate your first duty. Look at it here. 4.9% of 50,000 is $2,450. Now, they’re going put in an extra 25% on that old, I mean, look at this. So they take your tariff rate, they add it to your cost of product, and then they assess another 25% on top of it. That’s how they do it and now they add these two numbers together and this is your tariff rate right here.

Norman  34:45  

So on a $50,000 order, they were paying Wow, I can’t see that. 15,500.

Afolabi 34:53  

Yep, on the 50,000 order, you’re paying 15,562 and then they cried and I’m like something’s wrong about this and then we took a look at it, we found out that it was a printed product. It was a printed product. It wasn’t a blank product. So the duty after we took a look at it, the duty rate failed that, we reassessed it and they actually were supposed to be paying 2.1%. So from 15,562, they ended up paying $1,050. Total savings is $14,512. 

Norman 35:38

Back in your pocket.

Afolabi 35:40

Back in your pocket. You don’t need to spend.

Norman  35:43  

Yeah, you have the other one that you did with the quarantine signs.

Afolabi 35:48  

Oh, yeah. So this quarantine sign. I mean, it’s similar to this, not this one. So I think this is sold by Smart Signs. So Smart Signs, if you own Smart Signs, no police, I’m not picking on you. So this product, this guy was bringing it in and the duty was 0%, plus the 25% of Trump’s tariff. So when they calculated the duty, it was $5,000. On a $20,000 order, they were to pay $5,000. But guess what? They were using items of aluminum to calculate this duty. Remember, your HTS Code System, the US HTS code system is like a legal document. It’s how you interpret it that matters. You need someone that can interpret it very well for you and fight for you. Because if you’re paying the government extra duty or ignorance, they’ll take your money. The government will always take your money any day anytime. The goal is to not pay more than you’re supposed to pay. Okay? So the item classification they were using was items of aluminium and the duty rate for items of aluminum was zero plus 25%. So they were to pay $5,000 in over a $20,000 order, they were to pay $5,000 in duties and then when I looked at it, I’m like something was wrong here. Let’s dig a little deeper and see what we can do. So we found another classification that says items for display warning or advertising and the duty rate for that one is zero plus seven and a half percent. Because this product is an item for display, is an item for warning and it’s an item for advertising. So we decided to use the code for items of display and that brought down the duty rate from $5,000 to $1500. Total savings of $3,500 in your pocket.

Norman  38:11  

Beautiful, right? To the bottom line.

Afolabi 38:14  

Yep. So, you see why Norman was saying that if you were to do any savings, seriously this year, please look into your duty rate. A lot of companies that want to buy Amazon. 

Norman  38:30  

One sec. Connie, my wife, a coffee pour. Say hi to everybody. 

Connie 38:36

Happy New Year.

Afolabi 38:40

That’s the boss.

Norman 38:41

The official coffee pourer of the podcast.

Afolabi 38:44  

The boss.

Norman  38:45  

The boss. Yeah.

Norman  38:50  

One thing we should mention, too, that this isn’t a one time occurrence. We see this on a regular basis. This could be a weekly, this could be a daily basis that people are just not classified the right way.

Afolabi 39:07  

Yes.

Norman  39:08  

You can be a beginner because we don’t talk about that. Tell me a course that is an Amazon course or an eCom course that really talks about sourcing and gets right into HTS codes. I haven’t seen it really, it talks about how to source but we don’t really get into that side of it and it’s all these little things. We keep saying know your numbers, but it’s know how to better your numbers. Now you get your product coming in, you’ve negotiated properly, you’ve got these inventory strategies that are working, you’ve got the logistics side working for you. Each time you place an order or each time every day, you can figure out something that might be a little bit better to increase your profitability, and this is one bigger thing that you can do right off the bat HTS checks.

Afolabi 40:05  

Do you know that people buy Amazon stores just because of HTS code reclassification? 

Norman 40:16

I didn’t know that. 

Afolabi  40:18

You could. So I do get, maybe investors will reach out to me and say, Oh, I want to buy that store. Can you help me reassess the numbers and see if they’re saving some hidden savings here and look at the product and look at the numbers and say, Okay, how much is this person saving? What’s the cost of goods? When I see the cost of goods, I say, Okay, if I resource this product, I might pick up another five or 10% in price. But let’s take a look at duty papers. So I look at the duty paper, I’m like, Huh, this guy’s paying 12 and a half percent in duties on this product. Let me see if I can reclassify and I go in and I see Oh, it absolutely should be, we could use this HTS Code that will only make him pay two and a half percent. There you go. You’re picking up 10% from your cost of goods plus another 10% from resourcing your product. That’s the profit right there before you even make a purchase of this business.

Norman  41:14  

Okay. I never even thought about this before. But let’s say that you’re selling your store, okay. Or let’s say you got a guy like Joe Valley over at Quiet Light Brokerage. He wants to work with a company. You take a look at it and you say, Look, it can be reclassified, how far back can you claim? Because you can go back and say, oh, that the classification on this, we shouldn’t have had any Trump tax. It’s zero plus, whatever. How far back can you go and claim that? I’m just thinking about that now, that could be big if you can do that.

Afolabi 41:53  

That got to be big, I have to research that. I have to research if it was in three months, or a six month time period, you can refile your paperwork and say you’ve been wrongly assessed by a broker that didn’t know what they were doing. It could almost be, it could be a year.

Norman  42:17  

You want to check that and get back to me on it?

Afolabi 42:18  

Yeah, I can check that. That’s a really, really good question. Because that alone, the moment you purchase that business and you refile or you file for an amendment, and they give you this money back as money right away.

Norman  42:33  

That’s a really good point. So there might be people on here that are looking or a broker’s looking at their business right now and I know for like, the Amazon side of things that we’ll take a look and we’ll assess things and that’s from a different company, but to be able to go pre purchase and then let’s say, I don’t know how many people have just bought a business. Well, if you just bought a business, let’s say, the deal comes through today and closes and you have somebody that can take a look at the HTS side, and you can save 100 grand, or claim 50 grand. That’s a nice little Happy New Year present. Very cool. I never thought about that. That’s a great point.

Afolabi 43:19  

In addition to that, going forward in that business, you just continue to save that money year after year after year. This is money that the previous owner never knew existed. 

Norman  43:39  

Okay, so let’s take a few questions here.

Kelsey 43:43  

Okay, so we have a couple questions coming in from Manny. Is the HTS code nearly the same in Germany? Or is this only strictly for the US?

Afolabi 43:56  

1. Okay, I believe Germany still uses HS or unless they have the internal coding system as like the US. But only the US uses HTS code and the US code is 10 digit and the HS code I believe is six or eight.

Kelsey 44:16  

Okay. This is from Andrew. Afolabi, do you have any experience with Japan? I’ve went customs wanting to charge circa 30% of the final sale price.

Afolabi 44:25  

You mean to export out of Japan Andrew, or to import into Japan?

Kelsey 44:31  

Okay, so Andrew, if you can clarify and then we’ll come back to it. 

Norman  44:37  

Oh, by the way, there is a pretty cool giveaway at the end of the podcast today and if you want to qualify it, Afolabi is going to do a free HTS checkup reclassification. It usually costs, what is it? 500 bucks, 495, something like that.

Afolabi 44:58  

That’s gonna be the price for this year. Right now, I said last night it was still at 197. 

Norman  45:06  

Oh sorry. I guess I was thinking about something else. So anyways, because I thought it was a $500 giveaway, you’re gonna do, let’s agree we’ll do two.

Afolabi 45:16  

Okay, let’s do two.

Norman  45:18  

Okay, we’ll do two. So we’ll do two HTS checks for anybody who wants to just reclassify, or make sure that their products are being classified properly and if you want that, just say, I don’t know. We got to do this before the show. I was gonna say, I love Afolabi, but Afolabi, how the hell do you spell your name? Okay, so let’s just say I want HTS. I want HTS and you’ll be in the drawing for today and we’re also going to be giving away a box of chocolates to anybody in the US, as another prize. So we’re giving away three prizes today. All you have to do is I want HTS. He got out of the Afolabi thing because it took me a few times to get your name. Man, the last name spelling. Oh geez.

Afolabi 46:15  

My name? You gotta sing it.

Norman  46:19  

That’s all I do now. That’s how I learned it.

Kelsey 46:25  

We should clarify that the HTS is only for shipping into America, correct?

Norman  46:31  

That’s correct. Yeah.

Kelsey 46:32  

So, if you’re shipping into Europe, yeah, we won’t be able to.

Norman  46:36  

HTS if you’re bringing products into the United States and not Canada, just the US.

Kelsey 46:44  

Okay, so Andrew said, shipping into Amazon Japan.

Afolabi 46:49  

Oh, I’ve never done that. But I can research it too. I’ve never done that importing into Japan. I know importing into China. It’s not a piece of cake. It’s tough. Like China and Asian countries, it’s easier for you to export out. That’s really important. But that’s a good point Andrew, I’ve never done an import into Japan, so I can research it too.

Norman  47:17  

Okay, Andrew, if you could just give your email over to Kelsey. Then I’ll have Afolabi reach out and you can get that information. Okay.

Kelsey 47:29  

You can just message me on messenger or k@lunchwithnorm.com. Marina, I believe we already answered this. But what about bringing goods from China to Canada? Do we use HS code here or HTS?

Afolabi 47:43  

Yeah, the Canadian system. I haven’t imported into Canada. I’m guessing they’ll use HS. But I can research that as well to see what Canada uses when you’re bringing stuff into them.

Norman  48:01  

I think it’s HS. I don’t import into Canada.

Kelsey 48:07  

Okay, Radd. Do you think the Trump tariffs will go with us here because our products we’re paying 20% more on tariffs?

Afolabi 48:14  

Yeah it’s a really, really political question Radd.

Norman  48:26  

That’s a tough one. Nobody knows. It would be nice if it did go away.

Afolabi 48:32  

Yes, it will be nice. Well, sometimes I try to look at it as why do governments assess tariffs? Right? In the case of this present administration, I think it’s for trade balance. So maybe tariffs, higher tariffs is not always the worst theme. But, this is just my scenario, that if the current incoming administration does a way with the high tariffs, they could be labeled, as they want to cripple the economy. So I think they’re going to tread softly when it comes to tariffs, and I don’t think they will let it go away just immediately like that, but it will be nice. But I’m thinking until the trade is balanced, I think it might still be there.

Kelsey 49:30  

Right and if they do change, we’ll post about it in the group. 

Afolabi 49:35  

If we get the news that it’s changed, so you probably post a link of where you would check your product to see that the tariff has been removed. 

Norman  49:47  

Get that guy on. Send them the link. Carlos, you’re coming on.

Kelsey 49:54  

I’m gonna send you a link Carlos. If you have time, you can come on the show. Before that, Radd. With your permission, can I pass your info to my two friends importing this month from China and Taiwan?

Afolabi 50:09  

Yes. Thank you Radd.

Norman  50:13  

Alright and once again, if you want to check out this service, or the giveaway. I want HTS and give me two seconds. Yeah, he’s in his pajamas. So anyways, I want HTS. So it is a $200 service or value that we’re going to be giving away from Honu. Alright, so something else that we could talk about here. So getting started, you get your product, it’s at your warehouse. How do you find out what your HTS Code is? Where can you talk? Where can you get the information, so you can at least know what you’re paying, because a lot of people don’t know.

Afolabi 51:05  

You pretty much use the keywords in your product and if you want to do it yourself, you go to the website that Kelsey shared before putting your keyword there and then from there, you start digging, that’s the harder way. Or else, remember we said before you even order your product, please check your HTS code first before you order any product, because your product might not be as profitable as you think it’s gonna be or you might have to raise your price. Okay, so I think that’s the first step to know what you’re getting into and then the second thing is, go ahead and search for it, or talk to your forwarder about it. Let your forwarder confirm your HTS code first.

Norman  51:57  

Right. Okay, and that’s what I was getting at is just that contact a forwarder and you’re in the US and get that so at least you have an idea and then you can start doing the next steps to try to reclassify it. Alright. So is there anything else that the Amazon seller can do, any action steps that they can take to either insure or just take any steps further than going to their freight forwarder? So let’s say the products in, you’ve gone to the website, you’ve gone to the freight forwarder, any other action steps the seller can do to ensure that they’re getting the best price or the best quote?

Afolabi 52:57  

Is the product already on the US side? Are they already imported here?

Norman  53:01  

It could be? So I’m just talking in general. So it could be a product that you’re reordering or it could be a brand new product.

Afolabi 53:11  

I would say one very important thing to do is HTS codes, I mean, the tariff rate changes every time. So even if you’re paying 7% now, if you can do it at least once every six months or every time you want to import, you can keep reassessing to make sure that maybe the government hasn’t even removed codes.

Norman  53:48  

Yeah. Happy New Year. Mr. Alvarez.

Carlos 53:51  

What’s up?

Norman  53:54  

So I’m glad you got out of your pajamas. You combed your hair.

Carlos 53:59  

I got the gel.

Norman  54:01  

Very nice. Hey, all the best 2021, my friend.

Carlos 54:04  

Happy New Year to you amazing people.

Norman  54:07  

Yes. Hey, I don’t know if you caught any of the podcast but we’re talking about HTS codes and how important they are and a moment of awkward silence.

Carlos 54:23  

Oh, hold on.

Norman  54:24  

You lost me right?

Carlos 54:25  

I know. Here I am. No, I was hearing a like a reverb and I didn’t know what it was and I realized I was hearing you from Facebook and now that I had Stream Yard open. So I was like two Norms and two Afolabis.

Norman  54:41  

No, it’s not.

Carlos 54:43  

It’s a good start.

Norman  54:44  

Yeah. Hey, well, we were talking today. We were just kind of finishing up here. We were answering a few questions just about HTS codes and how important they are and have you gone through the system? Have you gone and reclassified products?

Carlos 55:00  

I mean, I probe my logistics people that I trust constantly and I’d be like, Hey look like an example being at Humidor a long time ago. I had sold some cigar accessory brands on Amazon and the first time I brought in a Humidor, they hit me with something called the Lacey Act or something and it had to do with wood and I was just ignorant. I was just like, Man, that means I’m going to take a bath on this. Because there’s no way after, like all the fees and everything associated with this, that I’m gonna be able to turn a profit on this and I couldn’t figure out why other people were obviously importing this into the country from China and selling at a profit. So then, I probe a little harder, I find someone that I can trust that’s going to go the extra mile to look into this for me and come to find out Lacey Act only applies to untreated wood. I don’t know if anything’s changed since then you guys would know better than me. So they classified me as it was another code and it was expensive. It wasn’t Lacey Act type stuff. But it was expensive and I still could not figure it out and what they had done was they had put me somewhere that had to do with, basically a bedazzled box. This is what it sounded like and then came to find out this is just a plain wooden box, like it falls under jewelry boxes and wooden boxes and everything like that and at the time, that meant I paid almost nothing. I’m not bringing that into the country now. So I don’t know what the fees are. I saw somebody mention the Trump tariffs. But you definitely need to constantly either stay on it, or I would suggest I don’t know what you guys say or just my secret sauce to success is just like hiring people a lot better than me that that’s what they do full time I stay on top of that, because that stuff looks Greek to me. I’d rather just shoot a message to Afolabi and be like, Hey, I’m getting killed here. Like, what can we do?

Norman  57:04  

It happens a lot. Again, you brought up a subject too, that we could touch on. I mean, we could do a whole podcast on this. 

Carlos 57:14

Let’s do it. 

Norman 57:15

There we go. Certification. We had somebody that brought in a product just recently and they wanted to have a certain price point. They wrote off that they’re 100% responsible for this product. We were saying what about certification? Anyways, the documents, or the product came in inferior, and no certification. They couldn’t certify it because it was a direct Chinese manufacturer who was selling on 1688, who had no certification. They were selling in the Chinese market. Anyways, these are the types of things this is why you can go to 1688 and do it yourself. 

Carlos 58:09  

You can also do your taxes and defend yourself in court as well. Like you could also do all those things.

Norman  58:13  

Exactly. Yeah. But 1688, we had a podcast about this. You hear about it from some gurus that go out there and they say that that’s not the right way to source products and there’ll probably be somebody here and says, I do it all the time.

Norman  58:31  

Wait, just wait. For 1688 there is no quality control. They don’t need any quality control, they’re selling in the Chinese community. There’s no certification, they don’t have the quality standards that we have here and there’s so many things about that and that can pertain to some of these products, because all of a sudden you get this product that you don’t know, let’s say it’s I don’t know, my family sells hand wipes, right? 

Carlos 59:05

Everything. Your family sells everything and they have a factory for it and like God knows how many patents. Go for it. 

Norman  59:10  

No, no. But anyways, let’s say the product is inferior and it’s supposed to be a certain type of alcohol. It’s a different type of alcohol. So it could be very abrasive. I mean, these are all things that even think about this Afolabi with HTS codes. If your manufacturer says and let’s say it’s somebody that’s not credible, okay and that’s why we do factory audits. But let’s say that they didn’t do an inspection. They said that a certain chemical was in the product, okay, that was safe and they put in a different chemical. The HTS code would be different. You could get creamed by the government because you’re importing something that could be something completely different. Let’s say I brought a simple one, let’s say my natural soap, which was 17%. I changed it to olive oil. Okay, olive oil was already in it. So I changed it to castile soap which was zero, but the manufacturer puts in a different type of oil, hemp oil or some other type of soil. Now you could get nailed

Norman  1:00:26  

What’s that?

Norman  1:00:30  

Oh, there’s Carlos talking to himself again.

Carlos 1:00:34  

I said you know a lot about soap Norm. I’m pegging you for the Doctor Squatch type.

Norman  1:00:39  

No, that’s my competitor.

Carlos 1:00:43  

I don’t even know you sold soap, my bad.

Norman 1:00:45  

I do, I sell soap but I sell fabulous soap.

Carlos 1:00:50  

You gotta tell me what it is. You gotta like message me cuz I’ll buy it cuz I’m about done. I just love Dr. Squatch’s ads, but I’m a bit underwhelmed by the soap.

Norman  1:00:59  

Oh well, just you wait.

Carlos 1:01:02  

I’ll find some new soap.

Norman  1:01:05  

Hey, Carlos, we’re gonna wind up in a second. But why don’t you tell anybody who’s listening right now and we’ve got a good group on about Wizards of Amazon. It’s a great group.

Carlos 1:01:16  

Awesome. Yeah. Wizards of Amazon is stemmed from a meetup group, local meetup group in South Florida, called South Florida FBA Amazon Sellers. I did not have the foggiest idea that this thing would be anything but a once a month event and then see who wants to show up if anybody. It’s turned into the largest Amazon seller meetup group in the world. We have 16 events per month, all of them are free and it’s a mouthful to say Oh, talk to Norm. He’s a South Florida FBA Amazon Seller or so we needed to come up with a cool name and at the time, I thought it was very juvenile and we’re like, hey, Wizards of Amazon. That sounds cool and the s was very intentional. So it’s not like I am the Wizard of Amazon. We’re all Wizards of Amazon. It’s like a group thing and it’s stuck. The domain was available, it was like the stars are kind of aligning. So I’m like, let’s go with this and the group is for all manner of selling. I mean, primarily focused on private label and wholesale. But we do have a good percentage of arbitrage in there. Amazon self publishing merch. We record, about two years ago, we started recording the events and we made them available in what I call the Amazon Video Vault, which soon is going to have courses and stuff and then people pay. I think right now it’s $30 a month to access all of the training and stuff like that. As a matter of fact, Norm is on at least three of those training sessions. Yeah, two of the events we have each month are for advanced sellers and I guess the way the only way we could think of to gate that was you had to show that you were selling in excess of 100,000 a month, which could mean you’re broke, but we had to do something and then for those things, we tap Norm’s wealth of information frequently. I see a question from Fatiha. Hope I said that right Fatiha. The events happen, yes, in Miami, Florida. For the majority of this year, we’ve been on Zoom. On the 9th of January, we’ll return to in person events. However, the events will be streamed live starting on the 9th, new thing streamed on YouTube, and gotta do something to catch up to Norm on YouTube, getting out of control with this. So it will be streamed, so you’ll be able to participate that way 100% free plus six of our events moving forward starting in January will always be Zoom based. Final thing about Wizards of Amazon, we have a free chat group on telegram which I’m absolutely in love with and you can find that at amazongroupchat.com and that is everything I think you want to know about Wizards of Amazon and Norm taught me everything I know. Afolabi is like the man. Matter of fact, there’s a presentation where Afolabi I think just gives away the farm like it just gives everything away. I’ve been selling for almost 15 years now and there’s like two things in there. That I was like, it was basically he didn’t say it like this, obviously but it was basically like, you’re only an idiot if you do there and then I was like, not only have I been doing that, but I’ve also been suggesting to my group I think it had to do with asking for FOB. Yeah, that was like one or two other moments where you guys humiliated me but like it’s all good. Afolabi’s presentations there already gives away the farm, so totally worth it. 

Norman  1:04:41  

Oh, one other thing. So I talked about this. I think it was Monday. Your book club? You’ve got a great book club and you want to just let people know about that.

Carlos 1:04:54  

Yeah. Entrepreneurs Book Club, is what it’s called on Facebook and again 100% free, there’s no like, give away your 401k. At the end of the day at the end of the book, there’s no courses, there’s nothing. It’s just a bunch of us that are into reading, entrepreneurial, inspirational, self help like building positive books. We pick one book per month. Obviously, a lot of us read more, but one official book per month and then at the beginning of the next month, we meet on Zoom to review and discuss the book that we read. There’s also a Telegram chat. So I’m pretty much bringing everything I do into telegram chat groups and again, the same way to enter that one is the same Amazon group chat and then you could just say, Hey Carlos, add me to the entrepreneurs one or just join the Facebook group, but really cool. I don’t know the book we’re reading this month. I don’t know if it’s Split the Difference or something like that. A little side things since you mentioned books. Norm was on my podcast, shameless plug here, Wizards of Amazon podcast and normally we ask and Afolabi, but normally we ask everyone Hey, share your favorite book and why.So if you go to Norms episode, there’s six books that he recommended. So at the end of it, and I think I’ve gone through three or four of them, I thought they were really good reads. 

Norman  1:06:19  

That’s great. So yeah, it’s great that you’re here. We’re gonna be giving away a prize Carlos. 

Carlos 1:06:27  

I want it.

Norman  1:06:29  

I want HTS again. We’ll give you 30 seconds to put that in. Anybody new that wants to have a reclassification. Or just check to see if you can save some money. Carlos, stay on for a second. We’ll give away these two HTS prizes and third prize will be a box of chocolates.

Carlos 1:06:48  

Do you do like a bingo poll? Or like how do you pull it?

Norman  1:06:50  

We do the Wheel of Kelsey. 

Carlos 1:05:53

The Wheel of Kelsey. Is that a thing?

Norman  1:06:54  

Yeah, it’s a thing. Yeah. So Kelsey, how is the wheel? 

Kelsey 1:07:01

Is it that time? 

Norman 1:07:03

It’s that time.

Carlos 1:07:05  

Things only your dad can do.

Kelsey 1:07:09  

Right. So the Wheel of Kelsey.

Norman  1:07:11  

The new thing in the new year, by the way, is going to be the Kelsey bobblehead.

Kelsey 1:07:18  

Okay, so let’s see. We got our wheel. 

Carlos 1:07:22  

I don’t see my name.

Norman  1:07:24  

Oh, you miss Carlos.

Carlos 1:07:27  

No, it’s okay.

Kelsey 1:07:33  

Alright. Here we go. So doing two HTS codes. So the first one winner is.

Carlos 1:07:40  

It’s like competing in some way and since I’m not on it, like wanna make a bet on who wins? Oh, too late.

Norman  1:07:46  

Oh, look at that, Mark got it.

Norman  1:07:48  

Okay, congrats Mark.

Kelsey 1:07:50

Let’s see 3,2,1.

Carlos 1:07:58  

Is this the same prize?

Norman  1:08:01  

Yep. Oh, Nathan grabs it. 

Carlos 1:08:04

Nathan Hirsch?

Kelsey 1:08:05  

Nope. Nathan Clark. Yeah, he’s one of our viewers and the box of chocolates. I’m not sure, I know Marina’s in Canada. Oh my God. Logistically with the box of chocolates for only the US right?

Norman  1:08:21  

Yeah, only the US. Sorry Marina.

Kelsey 1:08:27  

So I’ll just take you off there. I’m not sure.

Norman  1:08:31  

Let’s make it simple. Simple. Let’s give away two boxes of chocolates. Everybody wins who joins. There we go.

Carlos 1:08:42  

We got to spin it. I want to see the spin.

Norman  1:08:45  

All right. Spin it. Third place winner is.

Carlos 1:08:51  

Oh, the suspense is killing me. 

Norman 1:08:53

There we go. But Marcia you get one to

Kelsey 1:08:59  

If you’re from the US, you’ll get it but you’re from Finland.

Carlos 1:09:04  

Speaking of Canada.

Kelsey 1:09:07  

So Marcia, you got a box of chocolate.

Carlos 1:09:11  

Speaking of Canada, Steve in my group sent me a gift. Just out of the blue, I got this thing in the mail small box, but it weighed a ton and I tried it actually this morning and I was thinking like, this is just somebody like tooting their country’s horn too much, right? Like, this guy’s from Canada and he sent me this Canadian food product and I had it on my pancakes. It was Canadian syrup and this thing was to die for.

Norman  1:09:42  

Oh, yeah. Maple syrup. Right?

Carlos 1:09:44  

Yes and it was totally different from anything I had ever tasted in the US as far as syrup goes.

Norman  1:09:50  

Yeah, I love maples there. I’m like an elf.

Kelsey 1:09:53  

I got it right here.

Norman  1:09:54  

Oh, there we go.

Carlos 1:09:55  

Oh my God. It was so good.

Norman  1:10:01  

All right. Well, I think that winds up this podcast. Carlos, thanks for joining us.

Carlos 1:10:07  

Yes, you got me locked with no long sleeves. Take a picture because it never happens. 

Norman  1:10:13  

There we go. Alright. Afolabi, thank you for joining me today.

Afolabi 1:10:17  

Thank you. Happy New Year again.

Carlos 1:10:18  

Afolabi, always awesome seeing you man. I look forward to connecting with you a lot this year. 

Afolabi 1:10:23  

No problem. So thanks for joining us today.

Carlos 1:10:25  

Kelsey. Your Wheel of Kelsey.

Norman  1:10:27  

The Wheel of Kelsey. Yep, we’re gonna get a little tune going for that, too. Alright. So that’s it for today’s podcast. I hope everybody enjoyed the show today. It was kind of a sit back, relax, and just kind of discuss things. Look, if you would like to get more involved, come on. If you have questions for our guests, we really want to make it more interactive. If you don’t want to, just post the questions in any of the groups prior to and we can get those posted and make sure that they get answered and we will be posting the answers in case you can’t get on to the podcast. But we’ve got a lot of stuff going on this year. We had about a five hour meet yesterday with Kelsey and was it six hours?

Kelsey 1:11:15  

If you put together the two meetings, yeah.

Norman  1:11:16  

Oh my gosh, about what we’re gonna be doing. Some of the new things that are going to be happening this year with the podcast, with social is going to be really cool. So stay tuned. There’s a lot happening in January. Yeah. Oh, all right. What else Mr. Kels?

Kelsey 1:11:33  

On that topic, join our group. That’s where a lot of these things, new things will be happening. So a lot of this stuff will be exclusive to the group. So if you’re interested in Lunch with Norm FBA, or Amazon FBA and eCommerce Collective, go there, join the Beard Nation and one other thing, like I said in the beginning of the podcast, we’re looking to get some reviews for our show. So we put in a link for the Apple podcasts. This is only for Apple users. So if you’re using an Android, you can’t use Apple podcasts, and Spotify doesn’t have reviews. So this is only for Apple users. But if you guys are an Android user, you can always post a review on our Facebook page. That would be great if you can do that. So there’s something for everyone. 

Norman  1:12:23  

One of the things too, this guest that’s going to be coming up on Monday. This was somebody that was requested by our listeners. So if you do have people that you want on, let us know, we’ll reach out, somebody that’s involved with eCommerce, or any type of online selling, like if you want something more specific or detailed like Shopify or Amazon, or it could be just business and entrepreneur that’s built a brand. That’s really cool. But in this case, so on Monday, this is great. I’m not sure about you, but so many people have asked about Google and Google My Business. We’re going to be bringing on an expert Craig Darling is going to be answering all those questions about how you can optimize your business on Google My Business. So he’s going to be talking about that, how to create the citation, how to do all this stuff. Anyways, that’s it for today. Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Friday, at noon, Eastern Standard Time and guys, thank you for watching. Thank you for all the engagement. Thank you for help building this community, and all the best and 2021

Kelsey 1:13:38  

Happy New Year.

Norman  1:13:40  

There you go.